JPF Home Page Forums General Messages General Message Forum 2008 American Idol (original official)

Well... you're always being measured in music. In school you try to become first chair in the school orchestra. In a band, you try to get booked at clubs over the other local bands. Songwriters try to get THEIR songs cut instead of someone else. Anyone playing music is hoping that someone else will want to listen to THEIR music rather than do something else with that same time. It's always a competition unless you sit in your basement alone and do it for yourself. Then I guess you can say it's just art. Anything else and it's a competition of sorts.

Brian

Brian
I think there is no doubt that Truth will always win over false praise.

But just like here on this forum we have folks with the ability to tell someone the truth with TACT. That will help the person to improve through constructive criticism. But to tell a beginner that they suck or don't have any business writing songs is hurtful and accomplishes nothing.
Now I will admit that there may come a time when someone may have to be told they just don't have what it takes. It's like that in everything we do.

That is the one thing I really liked about this forum.
Folks made me welcome, told me the truth about my songwriting, offered me constructive criticism. They made me realize right up front that I had a lot to learn.....and still do.

Had they blasted me, like another site I went to before JPF, I might have quit.
I also had another site where I was told how great I was, LOL. I don't go there any more either.

Actually, the other site where I got really put down and discouraged made me start looking for a place to learn. That's when I found JPF. So maybe it was a good thing. But, I will NEVER go there again.

So far I have not been told I don't have a chance so I keep trying.

<<My solution is simple none of these really bad singers need be shown at all.>>

I'm in agreement with you on this point Jim. That's why I don't watch the auditions and wait until they've narrowed it down.

Yes, in school that is true, but that is training, not performance, and they do call it contest, but they are two different elements. I always hated contest because it is so forced, instead of artistic.

As far as the competition in seeking gigs, I really don't know who is out there trying to steal other people's gigs. I enjoy watching my fellow musicians, if I am not playing, and certainly do not seek to see them miss out so that I can steal their gig. It is not necessary. Music does not require one artist to suffer so that another can succeed.

Brian good answer to my question. I agree with your other point. Life is a competition. We compete from the cradle to the grave in everything. The non competitors get left behind. Even in our business most of us are very nice and work with each other teaching and giving advice etc but we are still fiercely competetive. Advertise any music competition and see how many turn up ready to fight each other over the spoils. I have seen too many fights, bribes, bands split, gigs or record deals lost/stolen to believe we do not compete. You bet we do.

I won't disagree with you on that Jack.

Art is a different thing. AI is not a contest about art. I watch it for the entertainment. I won't say that every performance is great. Some are really bad. But over all I believe the singing talent is good.
That is what the contest is about, Talent, not art. I think there is a difference. If Picasso had only painted images copying what he had already seen in other great paintings before him it would not have been art. It would have been Mechanical technical painting. But he moved beyond that. But he had to have some talent. And that talent had to be discovered somehow.
I would be willing to bet Picasso entered some Art (painting) contests early in his career. Were his Paintings Art then? Or did the Art come later? Did he scorn Art competitions? I wonder.

Art has nothing to do with commercial success as a singer. I don't think the AI contestants are worried about the art of there singing. They are looking for a career. The art can come later when they are famous and can do what they want.

The world should be filled with em!
Imagine that!

Wow, Jack nailed it for me...I think this is why the show doesn't interest me. I don't have a lack of respect for it, but this post explains my lack of interest. It presents one of my favorite things, people creating sounds, with one of my least favorite approaches, cutthroat competition.

Nevertheless, it's one of the most successful shows in history.

I once went to an art exhibition. Those guys are real competitors. They charge a fortune, many thousands of pounds, for a painting or a sculpture or a "pile of bricks" yep something you would see in any building yard. You should have seen them fight each other for business. These guys did not have smocks berets and easels. Most had entourages of press agents and personal assistants. A famous Brit comedian's catchphrase on a TV program is "art my ass." Pretty much sums it up. There is no bigger turn on to any musician or artist than the ding ding ding of a cash register with his name on it.

Now you are getting it Jim

The ding ding ding of the Cash register.


oh, how you like my new picture?

OH Bill I have always got it I've been exploited since ever I can remember. I just hate to see innocents being exploited.
By the way nice face lift who is your surgeon? I though Elvis was dead. Did you sell much ice cream that day?

LOL!

Not in Church
Those are choir robes
And it was the year the music died.

You mean they don't come round at half time selling hamburgers and ice cream. No wonder church attendances are falling. They do that at football matches and thousands go every week. I think churches are missing out on an opporchancety. Now there is a word for you opporchancity....

Brian, I hardly sit around in my basement playing for myself. You have a myopic view of music based solely on the music industry of the last 100 or so years, and while it is a vaild viewpoint, it certainly is not the only valid viewpoint. Yes, I have to deal with the business end too, but not during performances. That is the difference.

Jack,

I am unaware of me saying you were going to sit around in a basement. Why did you think I directed that claim to you?

And I actually understand the music "industry" before 100 years ago as well. In fact, I've been touting for years that we're going to see a return to something more similar to that than the mass media corporate version of the last 50 years. I've been trying to get musicians to focus on smaller face to face type fan bases that can support them for a living instead of trying to become mass media stars. I think that shows a clear cut understanding of how musicians made it long before recorded music was sold.

But thanks for the slam attempt anyway. It's always interesting to see when folks can't argue their point effectively, they try to turn it more personal.

Brian

Brian, I am not trying to slam you, but above this is what you said in response to my assertion about music as an artform.

I hardly meant an offense by it. I was only pointing out that there are more than one valid viewpoint.

If I offended you I apologize.

By it's very definition all music is an artform. Whether you want to get paid and compete or not is very much up to the individual. Some folk I know produce music just for fun. They happily perform free. Nothing wrong. It is a fun relaxing hobby. Others will do nothing unless they get paid for it. It is a business competition is always lurking.

I was hoping this thread would turn to something more exploitive; like when are people going to start finding and posting the drunken myspace pics of various contestants??

-Ethan

I don't know about A.I contestants, but you can see MY drunken Myspace photos at www.myspace.com/bobcushing

Bob How did I know you would use Ethan's post as a good excuse for a plug. Way to go......

Between Paula's flirting with the boys and Ryan working on turning the pretty girls over to the "dark side", I'm sure there will be plenty of scandal for everyone!

As we witnessed last year, the contestents don't even necessarily need any help from the celebs to get into their own brand of trouble.

As they said in the last show, "Welcome to Hollywood!"

I am a big track and field fan and I love the Summer Olympics. Bruce Jenner was the Olympic Gold metal winner in the Decathlon in 1976. A decathlon competitor must master 10 track and field events. In an interview several years ago, Bruce Jenner was ask how he managed to master all 10 events and his answer has inspired me for years. I think about it in relation to music often. He said, "When I started out, I wasn't very good in any of the events but I didn't beat myself up about it. I didn't look at the world class athletics and expect that I could compete at that level. I compared myself to the local all comers meet contestants. When I got good enough, I entered some regional meets. Gradually I was competing on the National level and eventually won the Gold Metal on the world stage.

When it comes to music, I think we all have to go through something like that process unless we are somebody like Taylor Swift whose natural talent is so extensive that she gets to jump to the front of the line. But my point is this: If we don't really have a clear (and honest) picture of where we are compared to the best, we don't stand a chance of ever getting on the world stage either as a songwriter, performer, publisher, reviewer, producer etc. That means that we have to compare our craft to others; and if we are ambitious, to the very best. To do that, we must be able to understand what the "best" is. Bruce Jenner had it easy in that respect because a 13.0 flat time in the high hurdles or a 9.9 in the 100 meters is not really something requiring an opinion. But good god- my wife, who is not a musician, and I, can listen to the Eagles play "Hotel California" live and look at each other and say, "That is bloody brilliant" Excellence is not in question-I don't think it is just an opinion. I am pretty sure that those of us who really listen to great music know fairly clearly where the good stuff is and who is making it!

I agree,

Part of the problem is trying to compare an apple to a banana. It might be the best apple in the world but if you do not like apples it sucks. Even a very bad banana is preferrable.
I have seen people who cannot see obvious talent because they dislike the genre or the song. I have also seen people judge someone as a great singer just because of the genre and the song. They do not really listen to the performance.

How many years has this show been on the air?
At this point there are no surprises. Exploitation?!? Every person who goes to one of the AI audition knows exactly what is in store for them? Good & Bad.
Of course there are plenty of really bad & mediocre performances. But every once in a while a gem turns up. It would be ridiculous to say there are no outstanding performances by talented people... But outstanding performances are rare.. that’s what makes them stand out.
I find the entertaining part of the show is to watch those gems get polished as the season progresses; just watch how their stage presence improves from week to week; as well as learning the reality of the music business as they go along.
Its no surprise to any one ... AI is a marketing money making business which offers a long shot opportunity to regular folk in the communities who may never have the connections to reach the AR people in the music business. It’s a crazy long shot; but some people are crazy enough to take their chances for the once in a lifetime opportunity to reach that dream.
For those willing to take the chance, they know the risks going in.

Ps .. Bill Robinson .. i love your new photo!
here's myspace address too! thanks bob www.myspace.com/joannelurgio

I have been trying to understand the way the music business works. Trying to put American Idol into some kind of perspective.
When it comes to talent (or vocal ability) I sometimes do not believe that is what determines success.
Or at least who we get to see or hear.
Taylor Swift is a good example.
I am going to try to be very careful what I say because I do not want it to sound like Taylor Swift bashing. She is the most prominent star that fits what I am going to say.
She has been compared to Leanne Rimes. I can't see that at all. When Leanne came on the scene her vocal ability blew me away.

Taylor Swift leaves me wondering how she ever got a record deal.
But then I learned she was signed when she was 12 years old.
One look at her tells me what is going on. She has the look. I have not seen a female that looks like that in a long time. She almost does not look real, like a Barbie Doll.
Her songs are juvenile at best. It is my understanding one or two of the songs on her album were written when she was twelves years old. The vocals are amateurish. She would never had made the finals on American Idol.
But I bet Simon would recognize her star quality as soon as he seen her.
She is a teenage pop idol, nothing more. Move over Britney. She reminds me of the Monkeys or Fabian. Stars that were created by the industry.
Why did they release the songs she wrote. Well I think they fit her perfectly. The beautiful teenage girl, with boys on her mind, the problems that teenage girls have. They are perfect for her and her intended audience. I even think they were used for their simplicity and they fit for her vocal ability.
It was brilliant

What she is doing on the Country charts is beyond me. But if the industry is trying to lure young boys and girls to the Country Music scene then they have found the perfect girl to do it with. She is drop dead gorgeous and can sing well enough to get by. Actually I think her voice is good enough that she will Mature into a very good singer.
I think she has 3 of the top ten spots for downloaded songs from the internet. That is phenomenal.

Unfortunately if this is where Country Music is going then the Genre is as good as gone. All they need now is A Frankie Avalon to compliment this Annette Funicello and they will complete the picture. I was a kid when all that went on and believe me every boy and girl wanted to be Annette or Frankie.

So where does that leave me with the American Idol thing.
Well, in the last couple years I have seen many AI contestants that IMHO can sing a heck of a lot better than Taylor, BUT...they don't look like Taylor. Taylor is a phenom.

Can you imagine a Taylor Swift with Malinda Doolittle's voice? Or Kelly Clarkson's voice? Now that would truly be amazing.

So the question, why haven't the American Idol contestants had the kind of success that Taylor Swift has had?
IMAGE, The Label, The Industry. They have probably been watching AI for 5 years looking for Another Taylor Swift with amazing vocals but she hasn't come along. They have had her since she was twelve, she is 18 now. And no one has come along to top her. So they could not wait any longer she would be to old.

That's my take on how this whole thing shakes out. I believe they have been using American Idol to find the next Elvis or Annette and Frankie, or Marilyn Monroe. But none have come along. They were grooming Taylor Swift for it unless someone better showed up.

I just went to listen to some Taylor Swift songs and watch part of a couple of videos. Her voice seems to be more geared to the "Hannah Montana", "Alley and AJ" type songs -- doesn't really come off as country to me either. But if she is popular and selling records -- then more power to her.

Performers like her don't need A.I. -- anyone that looked like Taylor Swift and had Melinda Doolittle's voice would probably have made it via a more traditional route instead of having to rely on A.I.

Kevin

That's a good point Kevin. But I'm not sure how true that is. Would Kelly Pickler or Clay Akin have made it without AI?
Or Kelly Clarkson?
Especially at twelve years old.
I'd be curious how they found Taylor to begin with.

I'll say that it's important to keep in mind that the money that comes in for a Pop #1 hit is WAY more than a Country #1 hit. It's like night and day different. Now perhaps Taylor is also #1 on the pop charts.. I actually have no idea.. but Kelly Clarkson, even with less overall hits, would be a far bigger money maker doing it on the global pop charts (which are ALL genres combined), rather than the breakoff Country chart which is much smaller in scale. It's sort of like having a Platinum record in Canada. It's 1/10 the size of a Platinum in the USA (same with Gold etc.)

LeAnn Rhimes was a massive vocal talent. But now that she's an adult, the novelty has worn off and now she's just another of the many top notch female singers out there in the Country and Pop field. We'll see if Taylor has staying power when she's 25. Until then, Country has really become the Pop/Rock music of yesterday. If you want "old" style country.. look to the Americana charts.

Brian

Bill,

Here a link to a bio of Taylor Swift. It looks like she legitimately liked country music from the get go. So she is real. She can't help the way she looks (lol!).

Taylor Swift at wiki: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Taylor_Swift

Kevin

I don't think so Bill... I may be wrong, but I think AI offered these artist an avenue that they most likely would not have had access to on their own.

Kelly Clarkson is a fabulous singer .. Kelly's image and performance were groomed by the pro's on AI ..
There are a lot good singers out there all trying to make it...
The little contact I've had with the music business ie: trying to pitch songs ... shows the enormity of the competition. Although there are exceptions, having connections to the business strongly increases your opportunity to get to the inside.

Like I said I did not want to bash Taylor Swift. There is no question she is a huge star.

I looked at the top Country Internet downloads.
Taylor 1,700,000 downloads
the number two spot Sugarland, 1,100,000
the number three spot Taylor Swift 900,000
Number 4 600,000

She is not as high on the other charts. About number 16. but still a couple million downloads.

Hey Bill,
BINGO you are actually starting to learn something. It is not how good a singer you are it is about how you look and how marketable you are AND WHO'S ASS YOU KISS. Re Taylor Swift... stunning looking girl however heard one of her songs, not impressed with her voice. Nothing special dime a dozen. I must admit I feel the same about Leanne Rimes. I really like the song "How Do I Live" it is very popular on Karaoke, however I do not think she does it any justice vocally. I am not a great fan generally of nasally singers, it shows a lack of basic techniques. Just about every female AI winner is prone to this singing through the nose habit. You would think the top dollar vocal coaches would do something.
Re Clay Akin, I could be wrong and if so I apologize, but he is the one I think murdered my favourite all time song Billy Vera's At This Moment. That should carry the death penalty. Now I AM a pacifist as you know but even I think there is always a time for exceptions and this is the time.
Re How did they find certain artists I would bet my shirt they are ringers. Mr Simon Cowell has done it before and will do it again.
The classical singer Paul Potts who seemingly came from nowhere as a complete rookie won "Britain's got talent" another Cowell show. He was a ringer and had agents and street teamers touting him all the way. I have proof.

I'm going to make a guess about the quality of the singers who showed up in the thousands at the Arlington, Texas try-outs for instance. Arlington is about 10 miles from my house but I didn't even know they had trials until I saw AI- but here is my guess:

Let's say 5000 people tried out. Probably 3000 are pretty fair singers- husbands and wives, sons and daughters who love music and can sing a little- own Karoke machines etc. 1000 are pretty bad. But AI isn't interested in fairly good singer or pretty bad singers- they are interested in really good singer and really bad singers. So you might have 1000 singers in each city that fit the entertainment target group. Of that 1000, the screeners select a couple of hundred to focus on- does any one know how many the celebrity judges actually hear? Let's say they hear all 200. Of the last 200, AI needs probably 50 seriously deluded contestants and 50 excellent singers to meet their entertainment goals. The screeners already screened out the pathological disturbed (we hope) but they do need a few that are right at the edge of pathology to keep the show popular.

Finally, AI producers really do try not to leave the most gifted singers in the bleachers because in the end, it is the producers interest to find the best talent- and unless the screening process is completely arbitrary, they probably do find the best talent-

but wait there's more- they have to find quite a few psychologically healthy specimens because the ordeal is rough on these kids and the very best one may have already said, "Screw this. Good bye" - Remember Kelly Clarkson's voice almost disappeared in the last couple of weeks before she won?

I am not at all embarrassed to say that I find the show interesting- I have 3 kids in the house under 17 and two of them are musicians- so that ensures that the show would be tuned in even if I wasn't interested- but I would probably watch anyway because I see talent and dreams and hope and love and drama. It's manipulated and packaged and sold just like everything else on television but we have been putting up with that since the dawn of the media.

They are very secretive about how many people the TV judges actually see. Nearly all the screening is done separate from them. If they saw 200 per city I would be pretty surprised. I do know they claim they had 100,000 people try out this year. And they are visiting what.. 5 cities? That would be 20K per city. I was told by one auditioner a couple years ago they got 30 seconds in a cattle call (literally a line of singers.. next.. next.. next... ) to sing. That was after they went through another cattle call where they were sorted by size, shape, type, race, age, weight and anything else you can imagine. That's a typical way to cast people if you're trying to hit all the major food groups. I guarentee you that if they'd found the best singers were all from 1 "type" there's no way they'd choose them. And that's fine with me. It makes for a more interesting show and that's why we watch.

We spent 18 months to screen 350,000 songs.. they spend probably 10 days or less to get it from 100,000 to about 100 or so right?

Brian

In the UK sister show X factor they actually audition over two days. A team cattle prod the thousands down to a manageable size who are invited back the second day. The panel and presenters only show up on the second day. They only see a handful of hopefuls mixed with the real hopeless and hapless, just enough to make the show. They claim that 7000 plus folk auditioned at each city. Well you work out the maths how long even allowing just a few seconds per audition would it take to get through that lot.

Amazing that on a site geared to songwriters, it has yet to be mentioned what a boon AI (and shows like it all over the world) are to songwriters. Every year these shows introduce a new batch of artists looking for outside material. Having had two Idols contestants in Europe release my songs, I for one am grateful.

Mitch
http://www.myspace.com/splitpeasongs

San Diego Auditions
Good Singers

Tetiana Ostapowych 24 venice, ca
pretty blonde
nice voice
Someone to Watch Over Me

Perrie Cataldo
single father
I'll Make Love To Yoiu

Michael Johns
LA, CA from Australia
white soul singer
humble handsome charming

several others but we deleted it

Mitch,

Isn't the need for songs fairly constant? i.e. there's always going to be a #1 song and someone is always going to have written it? At most, all that happens is the names shift around, but in the end, the same number of songs fill the same number of airtime on radio.

I thought the singers in SD that they showed were the weakest batch I've ever seen on an audition show. It was only an hour, so they only really showed 4 or 5 that made it through. The best singer of the night I think was the girl who said she had a crush on Simon in that creepy segment with her sister. I thought the first two had annoying quivers in their voices. It's possible they're better singers than what was shown and I have to think many of the best singers didn't get shown. If those were the 5 best however, then I think SD was pretty weak.

It's hard to really know who can sing based on the audition shows because they show such a little amount of the good singers and you don't see the previous multiple rounds they have to survive to get through. I think the small number the TV judges see are so filtered before then that most of the time they know which ones they're going to put through before that audition even happens. I am guessing there's a tiny fluctuation, but it's all pretty much decided in the preview rounds.

Brian

Just a wee aside note which actually happened to one of my singers..this is KOSHA...Diane...a stunning looking girl,tall long blonde hair ,and a really good singer...walked in to the screening auditions..never got to sing a note...the producer said to her..."you are too thin"...ok she is naturally thin..but to judge her on that alone was a bit harsh.....she was really hurt..never again she said!..i don't blame her...Terry...

I wasn't expecting the single father to do as well as he did. There were a couple of others, but I didn't think they were all that strong. A couple of them didn't seem to have any control over their vibrato.

The girl who's friend sat on Simon's lap was also surprisingly good. I don't remember her name.

Congratulations Mitch. I am glad to see that some songwriters are getting their songs used by "Idle" contestants.
However,
As Brians says I do not think that anything extra is generated from AI. Most contestants just sing karaoke type covers. Few finalists get recording contracts and those that do just push someone else away from the trough. Not to mention the in house team of writers who would be used before any unknown was ever approached.

The difference here is that Mitch is already a serious pro songwriter and competes on that level all the time. Had he been given a short cut to bypass the connections and dues he's paid, then that would be great. But he's just competing successfully on his own and doing the work himself. AI gives folks a catapult to the front of the line. If we created a JPF show and it was the nicest run, most fair system possible and did EVERYTHING right.. it would still, in the end, be a shortcut someone could choose to reach their goal. AI is just another tool. It's a high profile one where the downside is you have to subject yourself to the world of reality TV and all its flaws, but it's a shortcut nonetheless. Some people are willing to wallow away in obscurity doing local gigs all their life trying to make it. Most people don't want to do that. Some people are willing to put themselves up for abuse and scrutiny and the politics of appearance where they may lose only because they aren't the best looking or they don't have the best personality tying to make it that way. Most people don't want to do that either. But both choices are as valid as the other. It's their lives and their talent and their careers. I've never bought the concept that someone doesn't want to "sell out." If you want commercial success, that IS selling out. Period. I don't care how weird and unique you are. I don't care how much you say you don't want public attention and that's all bogus. If you want commercial success.. you're selling out. And what is wrong with that? Every job that someone works for pay is "selling out."

Brian

Brian,
I was replying to Mitch's post stating that whilst he is to be congratulated for getting his songs recorded AI and similar can hardly be regarded as a boon to the industry for the reasons I mentioned. You made this point in your previous post and I just expanded. Ethics and selling out have nothing to do with my reasons. Whilst AI might be a shortcut it is not open to many. and can hardly be called a boon. As for selling out I do not have a problem with anyone obtaining success as long as it is obtained legally and ethically. PS I hope the "Some people are willing to wallow away in obscurity doing local gigs all their life" line was not a personal dig at me. If it was it was a cheap shot AND totally unwarrented. I think Jack pulled you up on something similar on another thread.

Thanks, Brian -- both for the post above and for being so supportive when I submitted my first demo ("I Don't Want To Get Over You") to the first-ever JPF awards. My goal is to write and market songs that I like and that I hope others will like. I genuinely love pop music -- everything from the A*Teens to ZZTop -- so that's what I write.

Jim, in the pop world the need for songs written by outside songwriters has been shrinking. Many signed artists write their own songs; those who don't write often aren't signed until they've already recorded a lot of material. Every year AI and shows like it bring to the forefront artists who have great voices but who might not write their own songs. These artists provide great opportunities for songwriters to get their songs cut.

A boon for the entire music industry? That could be debated. A boon for the non-performing songwriter? That seems certain.

Mitch

http://www.myspace.com/splitpeasongs

Certainly i agree their are opportunities for Songwriters thru the likes of these reality shows..but i'd say perhaps with a few strings attached...For instance the Winner..well it is almost certain long before the final stages,the winner's song has been chosen,and it is long odds-on it aint an unknown or first time writer..probably an in-house writer with a pedigree is the likely candidate,or someone in the know,but you certainly aint gonna walk in off the street with a batch of new songs and get one chosen as the winners song...further down the pecking order is where there is a chance of getting a cut,for an album anyway..with say one of the beaten finalists if they are picked to release an album..but a cut is a cut in any language..Terry..

Jim,

My response was neither directed at nor involving you. If I have a comment to make about or toward you, I'll be pretty clear upfront about it.

I make responses about the general conversation combined with private emails I get, IM's I get, phone calls I get etc. all during the day that shape and inform my comments. That post was simply the train of thought I was having on this discussion at that moment. And that's how I post on the entire board. I often have no idea who makes a particular comment and I simply and replying to concepts being discussed. If someone brings up a point I disagree with, I attack the point, not the person unless the person in question is already making it personal on their end.

Smart people can say stupid things. If I response and say "that's stupid" it's not me saying the person is stupid.. just the comment.

Brian

i don't watch american idol too much, but over the holidays i watched AI Rewind, which was pretty funny to see some of the performances.

But i'll have to say that here in Nashville, American Idol has had a positive impact on the music industry as a result of Ms. Underwood's skyrocketing career. It was interesting to see Carrie grow as a singer but also as a songwriter. Chris Oglesby did a great job pairing her with other writers in town.

While it sometimes comes under fire, i think that a show like american idol is can be a positive thing. It can make people excited about music, which, with the way the industry is shaping up these days, is a good thing.

Mitch the need for new songwriters is shrinking as you say and that is a bad thing. I remeber when there was a huge variety of styles songs and writers to choose from. There was a lot of experimentation and ground breaking stuff was coming through in the charts on a weekly basis. Nowadays all we seem to see is karaoke cover versions of old songs and most of the new songs are written to the same old recipe written in stone. This has reduced the current batch of singers to producing mediocre hits. Most of the top producers will not break the mould and insist on bringing out clones of previously succesful artists or songs. As I have said many times there is so much mediocrity in the business it has become the accepted norm.